Super Sativas...or a mild case of the hermies

[Elephunt man]

Tons of good info on this forum on all strains, but I need this info, so here goes...

Ed Rosenthal and Mel Frank said:

Marijuana grown in the United States is usually one of two main types: inidica or sativa. Indica plants originated in the Hindu-Kush valleys in central Asia, which is located between the 25-35 latitudes. The weather there is changeable. One year there may be drought, the next it might be cloudy, wet, rainy or sunny. For the population to survive, the plant group needs to have individuals which survive and thrive under different conditions. Thus, in any season, no matter what the weather, some plants will do well and some will do poorly.

Indica was probably developed by hash users for resin content, not for flower smoking. The resin was removed from the plant. An indication of indica's development is the seeds, which remain enclosed and stick to the resin. Since they are very hrd to disconnect from the plant, they require human help. Wild plants readily drop seeds once they mature.


Plants from the same line from equatorial areas are usually fairly uniform. These include Colombians and central Africans. Plants from higher latitudes of the same line sometimes have very different characteristics. These include Southern Africans, Northern Mexicans, and indicas. The plants look different from each other and have different maturities and potency. The ratio of THC (the ingredient which is psychoactive) to CBD (its precursor, which often leaves the smoker feeling disoriented, sleepy, drugged or confused) also varies.


High latitude sativas have the same general characteristics: they tend to mature early, have compact short branches and wide, short leaves which are dark green, sometimes tinged purple.


Indica buds are usually tight, heavy, wide and thick rather than long. They smell "stinky", "skunky", or "pungent" and their smoke is thick - a small toke can induce coughing. The best indicas have a relaxing "social high" which allow one to sense and feel the environment but do not lead to thinking about or analyzing the experience.


Cannabis sativa plants are found throughout the world. Potent varieties such as Colombian, Panamanian, Mexican, Nigerian, Congolese, Indian and Thai are found in equatorial zones. These plants require a long time to mature and ordinarily grow in areas where they have a long season. They are usually very potent, containing large quanities of THC and virtually no CBD. They have long, medium-thick buds when they are grown in full equatorial sun, but under artificial light or even under the temperate sun, the buds tend to run (not fill out completely). The buds usually smell sweet or tangy and the smoke is smooth, sometimes deceptively so.


The THC to CBD ratio of sativa plants gets lower as the plants are found further from the equator. Jamaican and Central Mexican varieties are found at the 15-20th latitudes. At the 30th latitude, varieties such as Southern African and Northern Mexican are variable and may contain equal amounts of THC and CBD, giving the smoker and buzzy, confusing high. These plants are used mostly for hybridizing. Plants found above the 30th latitude usually have low levels of THC, with high levels of CBD and are considered hemp.


If indica and sativa varieties are considered opposite ends of a spectrum, most plants fall in between the spectrum. Because of marijuana and hemp's long symbiotic relationship with humans, seeds are constantly procured or traded so that virtually all populations have been mixed with foreign plants at one time or another.


Even in traditional marijuana-growing countries, the marijuana is often the result of several cross lines. Jamaican ganja, for example, is probably the result of crosses between hemp, which the English cultivated for rope, and Indian ganja, which arrived with the Indian immigrants who came to the country. The term for marijuana in Jamaic in ganja, the same as in India. The traditional Jamaican term for the best weed is Kali, named for the Indian killer goddess.

here is some info from mj botany.

[Elephunt man]

a) Colombia - (0 to 10 north latitude)

Colombian Cannabis originally could be divided into two basic strains: one from the low-altitude humid coastal areas along the Atlantic near Panama, and the other from the more arid mountain areas inland from Santa Marta. More recently, new areas of cultivation in the interior plateau of southern central Colombia and the highland valleys stretching southward from the Atlantic coast have become the primary areas of commercial export Cannabis cultivation. Until recent years high quality Cannabis was available through the black market from both coastal and highland Colombia. Cannabis was introduced to Colombia just over 100 years ago, and its cultivation is deeply rooted in tradition. Cultivation techniques often involve transplanting of selected seedlings and other individual attention. The production of "la mona amarilla" or gold buds is achieved by girdling or removing a strip of bark from the main stem of a nearly mature plant, thereby restricting the flow of water, nutrients, and plant products. Over several days the leaves dry up and fall off as the flowers slowly die and turn yellow. This produces the highly prized "Colombian gold" so prevalent in the early to middle 1970s (Partridge 1973). Trade names such as "punta roja" (red tips [pistils] ), "Cali Hills," "choco," "lowland," "Santa Marta gold," and "purple" give us some idea of the color of older varieties and the location of cultivation.

In response to an incredible demand by America for Cannabis, and the fairly effective control of Mexican Cannabis importation and cultivation through tightening border security and the use of Paraquat, Colombian farmers have geared up their operations. Most of the marijuana smoked in America is imported from Colombia. This also means that the largest number of seeds available for domes tic cultivation also originate in Colombia. Cannabis agri-business has squeezed out all but a few small areas where labor-intensive cultivation of high quality drug Cannabis such as "Ia mona amarilla" can continue. The fine marijuana of Colombia was often seedless, but commercial grades are nearly always well seeded. As a rule today, the more remote highland areas are the centers of commercial agriculture and few of the small farmers remain. It is thought that some highland farmers must still grow fine Cannabis, and occasional connoisseur crops surface. The older seeds from the legendary Colombian strains are now highly prized by breeders. In the heyday of "Colombian gold" this fine cerebral marijuana was grown high in the mountains. Humid lowland marijuana was characterized by stringy, brown, fibrous floral clusters of sedative narcotic high. Now highland marijuana has become the commercial product and is characterized by leafy brown floral clusters and sedative effect. Many of the unfavorable characteristics of imported Colombian Cannabis result from hurried commercial agricultural techniques combined with poor curing and storage. Colombian seeds still contain genes favoring vigorous growth and high THC production. Colombian strains also contain high levels of CBD and CBN, which could account for sedative highs and result from poor curing and storage techniques. Domestic Colombian strains usually lack CBD and CBN. The commercial Cannabis market has brought about the eradication of some local strains by hybridizing with commercial strains.


Colombian strains appear as relatively highly branched conical plants with a long upright central stem, horizontal limbs and relatively short internodes. The leaves are characterized by highly serrated slender leaflets (7-11) in a nearly complete to overlapping circular array of varying shades of medium green. Colombian strains usually flower late in temperate regions of the northern hemisphere and may fail to mature flowers in colder climates. These strains favor the long equatorial growing seasons and often seem insensitive to the rapidly decreasing daylength during autumn in temperate latitudes. Because of the horizontal branching pattern of Colombian strains and their long growth cycle, pistillate plants tend to produce many flowering clusters along the entire length of the stem back to the central stalk. The small flowers tend to produce small, round, dark, mottled, and brown seeds. Imported and domestic Colombian Cannabis often tend to be more sedative in psychoactivity than other strains. This may be caused by the synergistic effect of THC with higher levels of CBD or CBN. Poor curing techniques on the part of Colombian farmers, such as sun drying in huge piles resembling com post heaps, may form CBN as a degradation product of THC. Colombian strains tend to make excellent hybrids with more rapidly maturing strains such as those from Central and North America.


b) Congo - (5 north to 5 south latitude)


Most seeds are collected from shipments of commercial grade seeded floral clusters appearing in Europe.
d) India Centra1 Southern - Kerala, Mysore, and Madras regions (10 to 20 north latitude)


Ganja (or flowering Cannabis tops) has been grown in India for hundreds of years. These strains are usually grown in a seedless fashion and are cured, dried, and smoked as marijuana instead of being converted to hashish as in many Central Asian areas. This makes them of considerable interest to domestic Cannabis cultivators wishing to reap the benefits of years of selective breeding for fine ganja by Indian farmers. Many Europeans and Americans now live in these areas of India and ganja strains are finding their way into domestic American Cannabis crops.


Ganja strains are often tall and broad with a central stalk up to 12 feet tall and spreading highly-branched limbs. The leaves are medium green and made up of 7 to 11 leaf lets of moderate size and serration arranged in a circular array. The frond-like limbs of ganja strains result from extensive compound branching so that by the time floral clusters form they grow from tertiary or quaternary limbs. This promotes a high yield of floral clusters which in ganja strains tend to be small, slender, and curved. Seeds are usually small and dark. Many spicy aromas and tastes occur in Indian ganja strains and they are extremely resinous and psychoactive. Medicinal Cannabis of the late 1800s and early 1900s was usually Indian ganja.


e) Jamaica - (18 north latitude)


Jamaican strains were not uncommon in the late 1960s and early 1970s but they are much rarer today. Both green and brown varieties are grown in Jamaica. The top-of-the-line seedless smoke is known as the "lamb's bread" and is rarely seen outside Jamaica. Most purported Jamaican strains appear stringy and brown much like low land or commercial Colombian strains. Jamaica's close proximity to Colombia and its position along the routes of marijuana smuggling from Colombia to Florida make it likely that Colombian varieties now predominate in Jamaica even if these varieties were not responsible for the original Jamaican strains. Jamaican strains resemble Colombian strains in leaf shape, seed type and general morphology but they tend to be a little taller, thinner, and lighter green. Jamaican strains produce a psychoactive effect of a particularly clear and cerebral nature, unlike many Colombian strains. Some strains may also have come to Jamaica from the Caribbean coast of Mexico, and this may account for the introduction of cerebral green strains.


f) Kenya - Kisumu (5 north to 5 south latitude)


Strains from this area have thin leaves and vary in color from light to dark green. They are characterized by cerebral psychoactivity and sweet taste. Hermaphrodites are common.

h) Malawi, Africa - (10 to 15 south latitude)


Malawi is a small country in eastern central Africa bordering Lake Nyasa. Over the past few years Cannabis from Malawi has appeared wrapped in bark and rolled tightly, approximately four ounces at a time. The nearly seedless flowers are spicy in taste and powerfully psycho active. Enthusiastic American and European Cannabis cultivators immediately planted the new strain and it has be come incorporated into several domestic hybrid strains. They appear as a dark green, large plant of medium height and strong limb growth. The leaves are dark green with coarsely serrated, large, slender leaflets arranged in a narrow, drooping, hand-like array. The leaves usually lack serrations on the distal (tip portion) 20% of each leaflet. The mature floral clusters are sometimes airy, resulting from long internodes, and are made up of large calyxes and relatively few leaves. The large calyxes are very sweet and resinous, as well as extremely psychoactive. Seeds are large, shortened, flattened, and ovoid in shape with a dark grey or reddish brown, mottled perianth or seed coat. The caruncle or point of attachment at the base of the seed is uncommonly deep and usually is surrounded by a sharp edged lip. Some individuals turn a very light yellow green in the flowering clusters as they mature under exposed conditions. Although they mature relatively late, they do seem to have met with acceptance in Great Britain and North America as drug strains. Seeds of many strains appear in small batches of low-quality African marijuana easily available in Amsterdam and other European cities. Phenotypes vary considerably, however, many are similar in appearance to strains from Thailand.


i) Mexico - (15 to 27 north latitude)


Mexico had long been the major source of marijuana smoked in America until recent years. Efforts by the border patrols to stop the flow of Mexican marijuana into the United States were only minimally effective and many varieties of high quality Mexican drug Cannabis were continually available. Many of the hybrid strains grown domestic ally today originated in the mountains of Mexico. In recent years, however, the Mexican government (with monetary backing by the United States) began an intensive pro gram to eradicate Cannabis through the aerial spraying of herbicides such as Paraquat. Their program was effective, and high quality Mexican Cannabis is now rarely available. It is ironic that the NIMH (National Institute of Mental Health) is using domestic Mexican Cannabis strains grown in Mississippi as the pharmaceutical research product for chemotherapy and glaucoma patients. In the prime of Mexican marijuana cultivation from the early 1960s to the middle 1970s, strains or "brands" of Cannabis were usually affixed with the name of the state or area where they were grown. Hence names like "Chiapan," "Guerreran," "Nayarit," "Michoacan," "Oaxacan," and "Sinaloan" have geo graphic origins behind their common names and mean something to this very day. All of these areas are Pacific coastal states extending in order from Sinaloa in the north at 27; through Nayarit, Jalisco, Michoacan, Guerrero, and Oaxaca; to Chiapas in the south at 15 - All of these states stretch from the coast into the mountains where Cannabis is grown.


Strains from Michoacan, Guerrero, and Oaxaca were the most common and a few comments may be ventured about each and about Mexican strains in general.


Mexican strains are thought of as tall, upright plants of moderate to large size with light to dark green, large leaves. The leaves are made up of long, medium width, moderately serrated leaflets arranged in a circular array. The plants mature relatively early in comparison to strains from Colombia or Thailand and produce many long floral clusters with a high calyx-to-leaf ratio and highly cerebral psychoactivity. Michoacan strains tend to have very slender leaves and a very high calyx-to-leaf ratio as do Guerreran strains, but Oaxacan strains tend to be broader-leafed, often with leafier floral clusters. Oaxacan strains are generally the largest and grow vigorously, while Michoacan strains are smaller and more delicate. Guerreran strains are often short and develop long, upright lower limbs. Seeds from most Mexican strains are fairly large, ovoid, and slightly flattened with a light colored grey or brown, unmottled perianth. Smaller, darker, more mottled seeds have appeared in Mexican marijuana during recent years. This may indicate that hybridization is taking place in Mexico, possibly with introduced seed from the largest seed source in the world, Colombia. No commercial seeded Cannabis crops are free from hybridization and great variation may occur in the offspring. More recently, large amounts of hybrid domestic seed have been introduced into Mexico. It is not uncommon to find Thai and Afghani phenotypes in recent shipments of Cannabis from Mexico.

k) Nepal - (26 to 30 north latitude)


Most Cannabis in Nepal occurs in wild stands high in the Himalayan foothills (up to 3,200 meters [10,000 feet]). Little Cannabis is cultivated, and it is from select wild plants that most Nepalese hashish and marijuana originate. Nepalese plants are usually tall and thin with long, slightly branched limbs. The long, thin flowering tops are very aromatic and reminiscent of the finest fresh "temple ball" and "finger" hashish hand-rubbed from wild plants. Resin production is abundant and psychoactivity is high Few Nepalese strains have appeared in domestic Cannabis crops but they do seem to make strong hybrids with strains from domestic sources and Thailand.
m) South Africa - (22 to 35 south latitude)


Dagga of South Africa is highly acclaimed. Most seeds have been collected from marijuana shipments in Europe. Some are very early-maturing (September in northern latitudes) and sweet smelling. The stretched light green floral clusters and sweet aroma are comparable to Thai strains.


n) Southeast Asia - Cambodia, Laos, Thailand and Vietnam (10 to 20 north latitude)


Since American troops first returned from the war in Vietnam, the Cambodian, Laotian, Thai, and Vietnamese strains have been regarded as some of the very finest in the world. Currently most Southeast Asian Cannabis is produced in northern and eastern Thailand. Until recent times, Cannabis farming has been a cottage industry of the northern mountain areas and each family grew a small garden. The pride of a farmer in his crop was reflected in the high quality and seedless nature of each carefully wrapped Thai stick. Due largely to the craving of Americans for exotic marijuana, Cannabis cultivation has become a big business in Thailand and many farmers are growing large fields of lower quality Cannabis in the eastern lowlands. It is suspected that other Cannabis strains, brought to Thailand to replenish local strains and begin large plantations, may have hybridized with original Thai strains and altered the resultant genetics. Also, wild stands of Cannabis may now be cut and dried for export.


Strains from Thailand are characterized by tall meandering growth of the main stalk and limbs and fairly extensive branching. The leaves are often very large with 9 to 11 long, slender, coarsely serrated leaflets arranged in a drooping hand like array. The Thai refer to them as "alligator tails" and the name is certainly appropriate.


Most Thai strains are very late-maturing and subject to hermaphrodism. It is not understood whether strains from Thailand turn hermaphrodite as a reaction to the extremes of northern temperate weather or if they have a genetically controlled tendency towards hermaphrodism. To the dismay of many cultivators and researchers, Thai strains mature late, flower slowly, and ripen unevenly. Retarded floral development and apparent disregard for changes in photoperiod and weather may have given rise to the story that Cannabis plants in Thailand live and bear flowers for years. Despite these shortcomings, Thai strains are very psychoactive and many hybrid crosses have been made with rapidly maturing strains, such as Mexican and Hindu Kush, in a successful attempt to create early-maturing hybrids of high psychoactivity and characteristic Thai sweet, citrus taste. The calyxes of Thai strains are very large, as are the seeds and other anatomical features, leading to the misconception that strains may be polyploid. No natural polyploidy has been discovered in any strains of Cannabis though no one has ever taken the time to look thoroughly. The seeds are very large, ovoid, slightly flattened, and light brown or tan in color. The perianth is never mottled or striped except at the base. Greenhouses prove to be the best way to mature stubborn Thai strains in temperate climes.

[Elephunt man]

Fellow poster 'Motaco' says:

GROW INFO n TIPS

going to take a little time now to explain why growing sativas inside isn't as bad as people make it out to be.

the traditional method of growing dictates that you plant x amount of seeds, and over the course of several months of vegetive growth you weed out the weaklings and check for preflowers. etc. you know the drill. they flower for 60 days usually. but if your growing a sativa you might only veg a month but then you got 90 to even 115-120 days is not uncommon depending on variety and fertilizer regimen. so that is a LONG grow cycle for weed that doesn't yield very much when you put it up to the GE formula. not to mention its all to look for a mother and some of the plants will always be bad phenos.

the good news is that once you find a mom, and under most circumstances you can get a sativa you like that can grow with only two weeks of vegetive growth before flower and finish in 90 days and that is not a bad cycle for what your getting.

so the trick is maximizing space, plant potential, and time. its about finding a mother remember that.

and my answer is 2ltr bottles. veg your sats in 2ltr containers planted densly and flower after just a few weeks. the point is not to get great bud off of it, or yield. the point is to identify your mother ASAP. good plants will be good plants and shit plants will be shit plants from seed. once you find the one that is like you want you can keep it. take the main growth tip for a clone, and once the new tips are taking off happily its okay to flower. this is the long, but safe way to choose a mom.

the idea is rather then spend the time and more importantly an entire light on a strain you know is going to take a long time, you limit it to a few feet of one light, and about 90 some odd days.

the short way is more dangerous but it fits the bill anyway because alot of you don't have veg space to be taking all these clones and waiting to see which ones are good or not. The only real difference is that you only wait 3 days for seedlings to harden up before you flower. don't keep the light that close at first, until they want you too. a cycle should finish anywhere between 75-120 days total from seed. plants will identify themselves sexually after only two weeks. when you select the one you like if you didn't have space to clone then you can reveg. but revegs don't always work. but luckily sativas are predispositioned to reflower/reveg. anyway you want to identify the plant you want. and weed out the rest w/o wasting the time and light on it.

no sense having a light full of one nice plant and six that you'll have to find someone to sell it to.

when you get the one you want THEN you can spend some time and a light on it.

people say the genes change when you reveg but at least IMHO that rarely is the case. I've never noticed much difference. but if you have the option cloning prior to flower is always best for safety if nothing else.

Now remember plants and taste will change with time anyway, but in my experience I've never seen a plant that was superior to the rest be overtaken in quality by a different plant, due to a reveg. The one that was the best before reveg was always the one that was best after reveg.

this is also a good way to grow homemade f2's and 3s.

now very few people realize this but how long sativas take to harvest is very closely linked to fertilizer regimen. during the end of mid flower leaves begin to yellow but the buds have more time to them. growers react the same way they do with hyrbids and touch it up with a tea heavy in N. when really the plant was getting ready to finish and its part of the sativas biological clock was kicking in; the grower inadvertently told his plant that death was not coming, to keep striving to live, and the plant takes much longer to finsih. let me get an exerpt from mj growers handbook to help me illustrate how and why this happens.

"Plants growing in the wild outdoors obtain their nutrients from
the breakdown of complex organic chemicals into simpler water-
soluble forms. The roots catch the chemicals using a combination
of electrical charges and chemical manipulation. The ecosystem is
generally self-supporting. For instance, in some tropical areas most
of the nutrients are actually held by living plants. As soon as the
vegetation dies, bacteria and other microlife feast and render the
nutrients water-soluble. They are absorbed into the soil and are
almost immediately taken up by higher living plants." - ed rosenthal

now in places like colombia or thailand where there are native strains that can take as long as 6 months (in extreme cases) it is not uncommon at all for a plant growing a hill side that catches runoff to grow gigantic plants of very old age. often there will be 2 weeks of flowering growth, 2 months of flowering growth, and buds that have BEEN dead all on the same plant. and every bud age inbetween.

so its a normal reaction to biological cycles. if it happens TOO early than go ahead and give it a lil N. but beware, sativas greatest joy in life is turning N into leafy elongated buds.

another determining factor to how long a plant grows is root space, which you will become well aware of if you grow sativas. if sativas have an unlimited root space they will want to flower longer, grow longer nodes, and ridiculous heights.

typically you will repot sativas many more times than other plants. you want them to feel their restrictions, before they get too tall. anyone who has flowered a true sativa from seed will attest to this. it is not uncommon for a sativa flowered from seed to reach 6ft in two months. it is also advised to bend your stems and keep high winds and all other tricks to promote healthy stems. not only does this make the stems capable of handling large buds, but also any energy you can detract from vertical stem growth and put into other positive attributes will help limit space between nodes, and thus give you bigger, denser buds. when you limit the roots your limiting allowed vertical growth which at the same time is making tighter internodes. so long as you don't get rootbound your doing a good thing.

you generally wait until it gets a good rootmass, where when you remove the pot you can see healthy rootmass from the outside all the way down and then repot. grazing the roots lightly during repot promotes new root growth.
when you repot remember your trying to keep the pots on the smaller side. once the real serious amounts of stretching are done a few weeks into flower you can give them much more rootspace for bud development.

IMHO sativas should be grown in a soil or soiless with slow release all organic mix. sativas often become quite unmanagable under aero or hydroponics and are well documented to usually prefering organics over chems.

[Elephunt man]

by DJ Short, creator of the Blueberry and Flo strains

COLUMBIAN
Colombian Gold

Colombian Gold came from the highland Colombian valleys near the equator, as well as on the coast (the Caribbean and the Pacific).

This was specialty pot offered commercially in the mid-70's, for about $60 to $100 per ounce. It was seeded, but most of the seeds were undeveloped, white and useless. A few rare, viable seeds were found that were dark, small-sized and roundish. The buds were leafy and the most beautiful golden blond color. Legend has it that upon maturity the plants were girdled, then left standing to die and cure in the mountain sun and mist.

The color and cure were unique, and the aroma, flavor and high were equally so. The smell was that of sandalwood incense, almost like frankincense. The flavor was that of a peppery cedar. It was some of the most unique tasting herb in the world, and the high was just as exciting. It was truly psychedelic, powerful and long lasting.

First came the great flavor, then the stupefying awe of the shift in consciousness followed by a giddy excitement and bursts of joyous laughter. Smile-lock and red-eye made it painfully obvious who was under the influence of this great psychedelic herb.

The plants from the seeds of the Gold were primarily of Sativa origin. They grew a medium to tall size outdoors at 45°N (Seattle), and were mostly symmetrical. On occasion the symmetry was interrupted by one side outgrowing the other, causing a rounded and bulging tipped bush look. The leaves were long and slender.

When grown in Washington state, the finished product was a sweet, spicy Sativa bud that matured around mid-November. The high was adequate but not as good as the Oaxaca Highland grown at the same latitude. The plants were also slightly hermaphroditic.

Colombian Red

Colombian Red was the near polar opposite of Colombian Gold. This lowland jungle pot (possibly from Brazil) was made up of dark red, almost black, chunky little nuggets of what appeared to be hash, stems, leaf and seed. The aroma was that of cedar and hash.

In the early 1980's, the Red cost only $30 to $60 an ounce due to its appearance, making it one of the best deals going. This pot was a narcotic, knock-you-down-and-out, super munchie, red-eye express. The joints would only burn half way before drowning in their own resin! The smoke was very expansive in the lungs with a powerful pine/hash flavor.

Before subjecting its victim to fits of gorging and deep snoozing, the experience usually included ridiculously long spasms of uncontrollable laughter. The silliest little image could induce hilarity beyond belief. This was the main herb around when the Cheech and Chong movies first came out.

The plants from the Red were among the first grown out by Americans. There were many seeds, medium-sized and dark grey, that sprouted and grew easily into a finished product that was more than adequate. The plants grew low, dark, and bushy, with uneven and somewhat scraggly branches that were easily broken from wind damage. The locally grown varieties rarely budded very much, so it is not certain when they would have finished. It would have been relatively late in November at the earliest.

MEXICAN
Highland Oaxaca

Highland Gold, somewhat similar to the Colombian Gold, lacked bright gold color but sported purple and red calyx tips on its blondish-brownish-green buds. It had larger buds surrounded by long, skinny leaves.

I smoked this variety during brief periods in the early 70's and again in the late 70's, paying anywhere between $40 and $120 per ounce. It was some of my all-time favorite because the aroma and flavor were of a super-spicy cedar incense with a slight fermented berry taste, in a very comfortable yet powerfully psychedelic pot. This herb contributed to many great parties, concerts and events of the era because it produced a very socially-conscious experience and mixed well with other psychedelics.

With a long lasting, creeper high that kept coming on in waves over the hours, this stuff had no ceiling. One phenomenon consistently reported from the Highland Oaxaca experience was that of peripheral visual distortions of primarily cartoon color images. This tended to increase the visual distortions caused by other psychedelics such as mushrooms or LSD.

The Oaxaca Highland Gold was a nearly pure Sativa which grew tall at 45°N, outdoors. It was also one of the most symmetrical Sativas I have encountered. The plants grew long side branches toward the bottom, and the even growth made these productive beauties look like Christmas trees when mature.

The finished product was a very sweet and spicy herb of the highest quality, with a hint of fruity pine aroma. The seeds for this variety were small, dark and round, and the plants exhibited slight signs of hermaphroditism and required surveillance to maintain seedlessness.

Guerrero

This strain from Mexico's coastal mountains came in famed green, seeded spears and cost $60 to $120 per ounce in 1977. It had a spicy, almost wintergreen fragrance compared to the other Mexicans with a very clear head high and a most pleasant smoke. It was not as strong as most, but this herb still had a way of satisfying all its own.

There was a legend about a group of entrepreneurs who imported seed from Lebanon to Guerrero and grew the famed Lebanese Upper Mountain (LUM) from the late 1970's to 1980. The LUM was electric, psychedelic and slightly sedative as well. A unique herb that I wish there would have been more of.

The seeds from the Guerrero were medium to large in size and grey to green in color. The plants from these seeds grew similarly to other Mexican and Colombian strains: a medium to tall, bushy, productive plant. The Guerrero Green, however, is where some of the famed onion and garlic flavored bud of the Pacific Northwest originated.

Michoacan Brown Spears

From the high valleys of Michoacan, this strain was very similar in shape and texture to the Guerrero, but dark brown, and with a more peppery, spicy, woody aroma. $40 to $60 bought a seeded ounce in 1975. Although it was somewhat more bland tasting than the Guerrero , this semi-commercial pot was by far better than the commercial Mexican that was all too available. It had a more distinct, spicy flavor than the regular Mexican, as well as a brighter high that was not as susceptible to tolerance or burnout.

The plants from the Michoacan Spears were nothing great. They were thick and bushy and matured earlier than the Colombians. Some were ready in late October, but most were ready in early November. The seeds were medium grey and plentiful. Like the Guerrero, they produced some unique spicy flavors when grown outdoors in the Pacific Northwest.

THAI
Highland Thai

Highland Thai was among the absolute sweetest and fruitiest herb on the planet. The delicate, sticky Sativa buds so efficiently tied to the little sticks were among the finest of herb.

The Highland Thai, I believe, is at least partially where the Haze variety originated. It was one of the finest Sativa plants grown for its finished product at 45°N.

It is from this variety that Juicy Fruit Thai came. Juicy Fruit Thai was one of the original (and very successful) P1's of my breed stock. Juicy Fruit Thai grew fast, long and very unevenly. Every week or so another side branch would erupt in a growth spurt, compete with and conquer any existing meristem (main stem), and become the temporary meristem until another faster shoot overtook it. The leaves were very long and slender, containing as many as 13 leaflets, and deeply contoured.

The Juicy Fruit Thai took anywhere from one to 19 weeks in the indoor bud cycle to finish. Outdoors, the Juicy fruit was smokable, but undeveloped and leafy, by late September. Small buds developed during October and would ripen and swell during November. The longest I was ever capable of growing Juicy Fruit outdoors was until mid-December, in a greenhouse, and the plant could have gone on longer.

The primary drawback to growing the Highland Thai, after its leafiness, was its hermaphroditism. Though few seeds were found, and plants grown from the seeds produced only minor quantities of seed, all of the product was hermaphroditic. Also, many of the male flowers were sterile on some of the plants, or on certain parts of certain plants.

Out of all of the varieties that I have worked with at 45°N, this Thai produced some of the most powerful herb. This stuff was purely cerebral, yet mentally devastating in quantity, with absolutely no ceiling. Once, a seasoned smoker friend and I tested how far we could go with the homegrown Juicy Fruit. I recall making it to the 14th bong hit and being completely incapable of continuing. My coordination and depth perception were so skewed that I was unable to physically conquer the bong! The experience rivaled that of taking too much LSD, causing an incapacitation of the psychedelic kind. Yet, it was also uniquely enjoyable, entertaining and educational at the same time. I had sparkly eyes for a day or two afterward.

The aroma was a super-sweet fruity tropical punch and the flavor expressed itself both in the bud and the smoke.

Chocolate Thai

The Chocolate Thai was another being entirely. Chocolate Thai came in larger wrapped sticks of a deep, rich, roasted coffee color and a coffee-chocolate aroma that was heavenly. It is my uncertain estimation that the Chocolate Thai was a lowland variety.

The imported product itself was unique not only in its aroma and flavor but in its strength as well. This was a dreamy, sleepy, narcotic high that was long lasting and consistent. The aroma possessed a deep, rich chocolate, appeal.

The seeds, many of which were pure black, were extremely small and round. They were few in numbers and only a few would sprout. The plants that did survive were terribly difficult to grow, and all were hermaphroditic. The leaves were long, dark and slender, with most sprouting trichomes early on. This strain was successfully crossed with the Oaxaca Highland to create what came to be known as Purple Thai.

Vietnamese

There was a bit of the Vietnamese herb around in the 70's, primarily early harvest which was mostly badly-cured leaf. Nonetheless, it had a quality all its own with a spicy, tangy flavor and crisp high. It was great joint pot, but I never grew any.

I heard rumors that a Vietnamese strain was cultivated in the Emerald Triangle in the 70's and early 80's.

Opium Soaked Herb

An element was added to certain shipments of Thai herb in the 70's: "early water." A by-product of the heroin trade, early water was the leftover water used to create the heroin from the raw opium. It contained all of the constituents of opium except most of the heroin.

The curing Thai herb was soaked in the water and redried to absorb the opiate alkaloids. The result was a high that was sought out by some, but more than most bargained for. A good wash was an enjoyable thing, but some were over-laced, which caused a dilemma for those who would start spinning after a few hits on a joint.

SPECIALTY HERBS
Black Magic African

This herb is the strongest ever. Although I have only smoked the Black Magic a very limited number of times, and I've never had more than a joint of my own, I feel it needs mention. I did once get to see a bag of this herb that belonged to someone else. It looked like rotted, black leaf, some leaves intact but crumpled, plus a powdery black shake. It had no particular odor other than sweet spicy moldy hay, and rolled best into thin pinjoints.

The smoke was slightly harsh, but with a very deep, rich flavor. I also recall that it produced lots of white smoke. Anyhow, this stuff was dangerous! I often questioned if it was truly pure herb. I have, however, sampled the same product from different sources at different times, all with the same story.

It was equatorial Black African, the supposed herb of some tribe, Pygmy group, or another equally incredible origin! It was likely an indigenous Central African herb. One pinjoint between three or four people was more than adequate. This was truly the most devastating and consciously inebriating herb I have ever smoked.

I do not recall ever passing out or losing consciousness, but I did have to let go in order to come back . This stuff alone could cause one to reach 3.5 pluses on the Shulgin psychedelic rating scale!

I never was able to acquire seeds from the Black African, though I have tried. It is one of the few indigenous strains that I am interested in working with.

Durban Poison

Durban herb has reached semi-commercial levels in the past. All of the South African herb that has made it to market that I have tried has been a bit too powerful and speedy. I always get that heart racing effect similar to the Jamaican. There are, however, very many people who enjoy a good carnival ride herb, and Durban is a very powerful choice, indeed.

The seeds of Durban that I grew during the early to mid-80's produced medium/tall Sativas with spear shaped buds – uniform plants in both structure and finished product. Although production was good, the flavor was a sharp, astringent, chemical odor that burned the nose and sinuses.

The high was intense and strong but not notably enjoyable, so the Durban was dropped from any further breeding work.

Venezuelan

There was some fine Venezuelan herb available briefly in the mid-1970's for between $50 to $70 an ounce. It was sort of like the better commercial Colombian or Mexican of the day, but it was a bright yellowish color and not as tightly bricked, making the buds fluffier than most other bricked shipments.

The smoke was sweet, then spicy on the exhale – evidence of a good cure. The head was also a bit more pleasant than the more commercial varieties.

Unfortunately, I was never able to grow any of the many seeds available from the Venezuelan. I remain curious as to how they would fare both indoor and out.

Indian Elephant & Buddha Stick

There was a small supply of Indian tied stick pot available at the end of the 70's and the beginning of the 80's. These sticks were characterized by their large size compared to the smaller Thai Stick.

The Buddha stick was lighter colored and sweeter with a distinct juniper flavor. It was very stimulating to the palate. The Elephant stick was the largest tied sticks, some up to an ounce each, and darker. Of the two, I preferred the Buddha due to its being more cerebral and heady, but the Elephant stick was a fine and powerful product as well.

I was able to grow some of the seeds from the Buddha stick. It produced a pungent smelling herb of the juniper/licorice flavor. Most of the plants grew medium bushy, and most, but not all, were hermaphroditic. The harvest time was medium as well, 10 to 12 weeks indoors, very late October to November outdoors at 45°N.

I called the product Gin Blossom and grew a bit of her in the late 70's and early 80's. It was not until I replicated the flavor in the Blueberry lines that I retired the Gin Blossom strain.

Panama Red

From what I've gathered, Panama Red comes from any number of brash entrepreneurs who have damned the tides of oppression and grown copious amounts of primarily good old Colombian Red seeds in the wonderfully situated country of Panama, or any of her many isles.

Located a mere eight or nine degrees north of the equator, this tropical paradise has a coast on both the Pacific or the Caribbean Sea, without much distance between them, but a lot of elevation. The Panama Red that I am accustomed to was similar to the Colombian Red, but airier – not as compressed. It had a unique island flavor to it, with a spicy/sweet Sativa rush. Some called it the Tequila of herb, as it produced a high that greatly lowered inhibitions, creating a desire to consume more until it was too late!

For some drinkers, the Panama Red did not mix too well with alcohol, but for most it was a pleasant party high.

I did grow some seeds of Panama Red on more than one occasion. The plants were of the medium bushy character of the Colombian Red, with a little more hermaphroditism, and very long flower cycle (12 weeks indoor, late November outdoors). Unfortunately, however, this was at the same time that I was also growing the famed Highland Thai and new Afghan plants that were so unique, new and powerful, and the Panama Red became neglected.

HASHISH
Moroccan

Moroccan hash is the North African staple. It appears anywhere from deep brown to golden yellow and has a spicy leather flavor to it. Almost all Moroccan hash is screened and pressed. Though lower in potency than most black hash, this commercial offering costs less and tends to be more readily available through the years.

Moroccan plants are shorter and designed to grow tightly together, producing a single hemp-like stalk and a fat and dense single cola at the top. It is an apparent Sativa/Indica cross.

Lebanese Red and Blonde

Lebanese is another Sativa/Indica cross of short stature and density. A bit shorter and bushier than the Moroccan, it had a dark reddish hue.

The legendary Red Lebanese hash holds its own place. Red Leb had the distinct pine/juniper flavor and aroma, with a tangy spice leather to the exhaled smoke. It was sharp on the sinuses and nasal passages.

Most Red Leb hash was screened and pressed, except for the legendary Red Lebanese Honey Oil. The famed oil, only available to me from 1973-77, was in a class all of its own. The oil had a sharp juniper/cedar smell to it. It was the most powerful, lung expansive cannabis product that I had ever encountered. We would buy these glass oil pipes simply to find them useless, as no one could hold even the smallest toke of this stuff.

The oil had to be smeared onto a rolling paper or the side of a cigarette, or it had to be chased into a pile of herb with a flame from below. It was truly some of the finest. The home-grown isomerized oils of the 80's were pale in comparison to the great Red Leb.

Lebanese Blonde, the "working person's hash," was a lower grade of hash than the Red, and quantities were less expensive as well. It was less dense, making grams appear larger and giving the illusion of economy. Good Blonde had character, a spicy/woody flavor and aroma, plus a clean, woody taste. The high was a bit more than the Red, furthering the appeal to working people.

Nepalese temple balls

The Buddhists have a saying: "May all beings be happy." They also have a hash to back it up with: black finger rubbings from high in the Himalayas. This was some of my all-time favorite.

Nepalese is among the most cerebral of hashish. A strong yet pleasant head journey packed in every puff. This is some of the happiest hash I have experienced. The taste is spicy/fruity/earthen and among the most enjoyable of hash flavors. Most Nepalese hash is from rubbings, although I have heard from travelers to the area that screened and pressed varieties are available.

Simply put: Nepalese Temple Ball is some of the happiest, fruitiest and most pleasantly flavorful, highest quality hash that I have ever experienced.

Afghanistan & Hindu Kush

Rolling off the great crest of the Himalayas to the west and to the north are an apex of mountainous zones that define the northern borders of Afghanistan and Pakistan. Squished among these is the little region of Kashmir and the Hindu Kush mountains. This area may well be the oldest hashish producing area in the world, perhaps the birthplace of hash!

The plants of the area, the Indica variety, have been manipulated and bred by humans since antiquity. Short, dense and stout, with wide, dark leaves, these plants make the best of their high mountain, short-seasoned environment. They were bred to produce large amounts of easily detachable glandular resin heads, ideal for hashish production. These areas incorporate both rubbed, screened and pressed methods of hashish production.

Afghan hash, and the Indica strain for that matter, possess a much more sedative, dreamy, narcotic effect compared to the Sativa. This is true of the Afghan and Hindu Kush plants grown in the Pacific Northwest since 1978.

I believe more Indicas should be made into hashish, which is where the finer qualities of the Indica appear.

A quantity of Afghan seed was smuggled to the Emerald Triangle in 1978. Commercial production of the strain began shortly after that. There may have been earlier trials with Afghan seed in the region prior to 1978, but none ever made it to commercial production quantities or to public market.

THE ISLANDS
Hawaiian

Hawaiian a true classic. There is something special about a good island herb, and Hawaiian is among the best. When properly grown outdoors it has a wonderful and unique bouquet of fruity spice, similar to the sweetness of the fine Thai, but with a kind of tangy taste.

Good Hawaiian herb has always been a devastatingly powerful experience for me. It is very psychedelic and internally focused, contemplative and overpoweringly meditative. A Walk with the King, a Dance with the Queen, and a sunset on the beach! Aah... Hawaiian!

I have tried to equal the Hawaiian experience outdoor on the mainland, and indoors, with no success. Everything I have grown from Hawaiian stock turned out to be nowhere near the quality of the parent stock. This is true for three generations of trials. The product from Hawaiian seed was equal to the best plants grown from mid-quality Colombian stock!

This led me to a hypothesis about Hawaii: that just about any stock grown in Hawaii will turn out to be of unique and relatively high quality. Hawaii just happens to be one of those special places, I suppose.

All breeding attempts with Hawaiian stock were dumped from my garden by 1983. It was a pretty and robust plant though, and also quite productive. Just not all that impressive when grown outside its homeland.

Jamaican Lion's Herb

It has been on rare occasion that I have sampled truly enjoyable Jamaican herb. These rare samples came directly from friends who knew growers there. It was similar to the Hawaiian experience, but with more of a take-your-breath-away feeling of excitement.

The problem I have encountered with the commercial Jamaican is that it is too damned strong and speedy! Jamaican is renowned for its lively herb, for which I can vouch. It is a heartlifting herb and I have a sensitive heart. So I am careful with the samples of the commercial Jamaican ganja that I try.

Much like Hawaiian, the Jamaican strains are perhaps best expressed in their homeland, because I have had little success in producing an adequate example. Both indoors and out, the Jamaican behaves and ends up much the same as mid-level Colombian. Perhaps all Island herb is unique in this fashion.

Philippine Thrilla from Manilla.

The Philippines are another Island chain renowned for producing great herb. I once possessed a small quantity of what was supposed to be Philippine herb in the late 1970's. It had a strong citrus aroma that produced a spicy smoke and a heady high. I never grew the strain, so I have nothing to report on the plants. The herb was a light green Sativa and seeded, so hopefully someone has had experience with this strain."

[Elephunt man]

*text to be edited in*

[Elephunt man]

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[Elephunt man]

*text added later...pics by Rahan*

[Elephunt man]

Two on left molokai frost phenos, top middle oaxaca, bottom middle hawaiian sativa, top right vietnam black pheno willi nelson, bottom right nep pheno willi nelson f2's or 3's of course. (Oaxacan is circa 1967)

[Elephunt man]

Fellow sativa lover Motaco said:

Reminds me of what an old dealer I used to have would tell people. It was during that era that "indo" was starting to actually hit the street market. Just powerful sleepy BC indica in those days. back when kindbud lbs were red not green lol.

He didn't like this new bud, or the market. He said people were trying to turn weed into drugs and he didn't like it, didn't think it was good for people cuz it didn't get them high it got them loaded and sleepy, and he wasn't going to sell it. He was very oldschool. Never owned a pipe; he rolled everything he smoked. Rare to find he had quality control on his schwag. he wouldn't buy nasty lbs. only the good ones. Good schwag and midgrade was all he ever sold.

When people would come around and ask for "endo" he'd tell them: "Two blocks down and make a right, they got black tar heroin $10 dollar holla's. Your gonna have to go catch your NODS with them fools because we're getting HIGH on this corner"

and I know where he's coming from. we got weed that gets you HIGH and we got weed that gets you LOW. if your looking to get LOW you better stop and think on it for a while. are you actually trying to catch a weed buzz or maybe just substituting it for something else?

[Elephunt man]

Panama Red

[Elephunt man]

The opinion from 20'Thaï, a great grower that posted it at Overgrow, in the North African vs South African thread:


Quoting: "20 Thai"
The method I use for the 100% sativas such as any of the AfricanSeeds strains/SEAsians-etc, is similar, weather I grow them indoors completly or start them indoors and then take them out. Chris from African Seeds a few years ago told me that it was near impossible to get a good harvest from his strains if grown under a HID enviroment using only soil as a medium due to their excessive stretching and high lightpower requirements - making it open wide and tall and not keeping it compact. I have informed him since that this is not the case. He sent me a sample of all his strains to try out and give him my opinion on them (which btw I loved so much that 2years later I ordered 3packs of each one off him that I gladly paid for). All except for his Tanzanian as it was not on his list of strains back then. After the first go, I realised the only problem with growing them indoors was, as he said, their stretch. But to eliminate that, I merely grew them from the beginning under 12/12 regime AND all in small pots till they showed sex (at 5weeks) prior to trasplanting into a slightly larger pot, but not too large(I'll explain this). This is how I do it:

Start them at 12/12 (no vegging at all) in a small milkshake sized pot, and crop the top when they 'first show sex (around the 6th node - around 1foot tall)', at the 3rd true node(the cut that is). Then transplant into 6-8inch pots, they'll finish stretching at 3-4feet tall and very bushy with 2 main colas and alot of lower branching that end just passed mid-way up the 2 main colas...thereby making them very indoor friendly due to their low hieght. Now having controlled their height, the only other thing one need do is assure a good yield. To maximise the yield, transplant again at 4weeks flower(after 2weeks of preflower/showing-sex) into a large pot for megayield indoors 2to2.5months after that...or..in the case of RooiBart, harvesting can occur 1.5months/6weeks after the final transplant.

The trick to successfully growing 100% sativa indoors so that they yield more than a good hybrid(ie compact with many many bud sites) is:

a. Never veg from seed - 12/12 from start to finish. This does not increase male rates in Africanas dramatically, as it does in many other genepools.

b. Never transplant the first time (upon showing sex) into a pot that is LARGER than 8inches in dia(6inches dia pot is better for grows under 600W) - or they'll stretch to the moon.

c. Once they've finished stretching(5-6weeks after the first transplant), and NOT BEFORE, transplant into as large a pot as possible for scrog type grow till finished. They'll then grow out and fill with compact noding, even though they won't use all the new soil in the larger new pot that they've been put into(they won't finish rootbound, but they'll finish with an excellent yield given their size). Also given that the plant will NOT rootbound itself in this last pot, they breath well till harvest and fan leves find it easier to remain green even AFTER the buds amber up. So beware of this...do not wait for yellowing fan leves as a sign of maturity if using this method.

I have've also grown 2 types of Durbin Poison indoors - AfricanSeeds's and DPassion's. DP's is a hybrid so I vegged it as normal for 5-6weeks before 12/12ing for a good yield. BUT... using the above prementioned IBL method, AfricanSeeds's DPoison yields TWICE what DPassion's does when both strains finish at the same height. About 4foot tall and cropped once giving 2 main colas. The difference is amazing. The DPassion 4foot tall finished under 1 600Whps yielded 4ounces. The ASeeds DPoison 4foot tall yielded just over 8ounces and was much more aromatic (fruity aniseed) and about twice as potent. Outdoors, when I trasplant the AFseeds into a large pot (40litres) for its final resting pot, it can yield up to 1lb before our SummerEquinox - and the resin is more activated due to the sun's more intense UVB rays at that time of the year.



So the secret/trick to regulating the stretch of the 100% sativas is not vegging them at all from seed, but more importantly, restricting their root system's growing volume from the beginning of stretch, till the end. After that, trasplant them into as big a volume of soil as you wish and NO further stretching occurs - so long as they stay in flower. The larger the volume of soil that they have after their stretch has finished, the bigger the yield - not the stretch.

.....

Hi Rahan,

You will always get very little stretch from any strain that is allowed to veg for a good time in the same pot that flowering is induced under(weeks after vegging has occured). The same applies to anyone who has ever tried to revegg and flower an already finished plant in the SAME pot that its' first harvest was taken in. People should be aware that the only time real stretching can occur with cannabis, especially in preflower, is when a good volume of NEW/virgin soil is introduced or is allowed to surround the already WELL established root-ball. It is only then, that the plant can provide us with a sudden and spectacular 'final reach' upwards as flowering commences. This is why 'stretch factors' that are quoted by good growers and seed suppliers can only be had as such IF the plant is vegged in its' 2ND largest pot and then transplanted into its' largest pot 1-2weeks PRIOR to initiating a 12/12 regime. As this gives the plant jsut enough time to grow into the soil and realise that there is plenty of NEW soil with which it can suddenly grow new roots to compliment its' final stretch. Also keeping in mind that MOST of these quoted stretch factors are 'true' when a plant of NOT cropped/clipped and hase only one main shoot. The more the main shoots it has, the lesser the stretch factor 'provided' as it has to be dispersed into more than one mainstem.

So this is why I outline that one do their LAST transplant into the plants largest/final pot AFTER all preflower stretching has occured...as it has ALREADY been restricted by using a small pot during 'preflower and 2-3weeks after', for if it wasn't then instead of ending up between 3-5foot tall at most, it would've stretched to an easy 8foot tall and much more(with Sativa IBLs and Landraces). So IOW, it is this restriction of roots at just the right time that can be used to opposite effect to maximise the size and yield of lesser stretching plants like indicas and the like with MINIMAL vegging period. You'd be amazed Rahan how heavily noded and yielding a 3-4foot tall IBL sativa can become when grown using the method I outlined above that restricts stretching by root restriction of the right proportion. That way one NEED NOT veg the plant for a long time and trim back twice to then hopefully end up with a reasonably sized indoor sativa. The vegging period with an IBL/Landrace sativa with an UNCLIPPED mainshoot can be effectively reduced to the minimal period required for the plant to show 'sex' when started under 10-11 hours day from sprout or a few days after sprouting under an 18hour light regime...which can trigger sexing in IBL's a little faster than had they been sprouted under a flowering photoperiod, but NOT with landrace sativas. The only thing that gets pure landrace sativas into flowering quicker lots of darkness and flowering ferts in the soil from day one. But not too much ferts as this can also increase herm and male rates with landraces. It's all a balancing act that can be easier won with patience rather than eagerness.

So if you try the method I outlined above, it's success will lay in the TIMING of the last pot transplant into the largest/finishing pot. If you do it too early, the plant will go into a state of flowering-stretch/vegging-flowering and end up stretching excessively...as do landrace SEAsians when provided with lots of spare soil that the roots can continue growing in. They'll stretch to the moon if transplanted into a larger soil volume at anytime after vegging. Be they in Preflower of flower they don't care...if they sense more soil, a stretching they will go. So to grow them successfully and restrain their height while still getting an excellent yield without clipping the mainistem requires a COMPLETLY different strategy to the one I outlined for the Africanas(or most IBL sativas that are NOT landraces). I should also point out that most African strains available including those from AfricanSeeds, are NOT true pure landrace sativas. They are more an IBL sativa heavily acclimatised to the region they came from, but where origianlly a blending/crossing of other pure sativas that where available long ago. This is why NONE of them have preflowering stretch factors in excess of 20 to 1...as does the DALAT Nam which can easily go 25 to 1 even in a 20Litre pot. From a couple of inches tall to over 5 foot tall finished with 10/14 form day one and flowering commenced from the time the clone has set-root and been placed into the 20L odd pot. I had Shantis NevHAze do me a 9 to 1 stretch that seem considerable, till I tried the Nam and other SEAsian landraces. They stretch so much that they need no vegging to become huge.

[Elephunt man]

The opinion of Chaman, a great grower from Overgrow too. This was posted at Queijo's forum:


Quoting: "Chaman"
I have learnd to use containers for may sats for better controll aslo, basicly i try too hold up and root bound them untill I finlay get a good early flower, then i transpant of a larger pot with a silght different mix to finish them. If you transplant too soo...the girl becomesa monster and grows more ! If you wait too much, you loose a great deal of yield...

So I start them in 3 gall containers, and the mix can be 2parts my soil, its very good rich soil to be honest on it's own as where I live it's very volcanic and plenty of rainforests keep the soil alive and full of activity. I add to it worm castings and farm mix too complete the 3 gallons. Farm mix, well just how it sounds. My family has farms in which they colect all the craps from everything, pigs, goats, cows, cafs, horses, and many chickens turkeys and geese along with saw dust, and ginded up and realy diced compost and add some white podwer think it might be "kal" then the rotate it an age it under larg black plastic sheets, I come around and just fill a few sacks now and then and take it home to play with.

Then when it's complete root bound and in early flower i transplant too a 5 to + gall contianer depending on how much i might think she will take longer, the longerthe larger the pot...but this time i put in the bottom of the pot dry'd diced straw, then 2 parts soil, some farm mix, some worm casting, and some bat guano, more bat guano then wormcastings then mix it all up realy well. The straw becomes N later when the plant might need it, and hels your soil drian, and also atracks worms to better come in and better your soil make'n it more aireated for one. Coco fiber or rice hauls if no straw is avialable. This soil sustians the plant till finish...

If plants start to show signs that they need somethings say in veg i give thm a Tea of Farm mix (compost and animal dun can only imaigne help grow...so far been working awesome) then in flower if need anythign i give them a Guano tea when needed, nothing else.

[Elephunt man]

Chaman:

Very honored as I may not have gone into such great detail as my friend 20' went into, but was take’n into consideration amoung so many great herbsman. I would like to add that if you have time...and are not presured with the cost of your running equipment.

When I had lights it gave a slow start, but once in rotation its cool runnings !

Start your Sativas under thier light periods, do homework and look up the places they are from and simply check how many hrs they get of day and night during what months, how many or what months and try to equal that. If they are near cities or out in the country sides as if near cities they can take some light contamination, or if they are from the country side where they’d stress under minimum light contamination.(example my Colombian Gold hermied one time due to sensor lights I had set up for 1min, but as dogs would walk about so much 1min, everynow and then was enough to make her not want to flower right, take longer, stress and put out a few bananas.) Truely, Sativas do not need to be veged the first time till you find your moms, but veg your clones when cut to small maybe.

Started my seeds in 16oz cups, under many floros for 12hrs day and night, plants grew well. I Think a MH would give more heat and a better start next time though would have to play with that idea, the floros aren’t hot enough like nice sunny tropical days. The drier ambient might bring out more males too. High amounts of N, and good humity will give more females, so that’s a con against the MH, specialy since ive always gotten great female ratios with the floros…

Sucks as now you got to select and kill those less aproiate. Those with longer nodes, less vigor, iregular leafs or growths for starters. Plants will tend to sex in about a 5-6weeks, males in about 4-5. Once I've dediced what to do with males I go to the next step. Males you keep and set aside or you kill....its realy not easy to kill your plants I suffer a great deal each time, but remember you don't need trouble and an extra unproductive male counts as a plant more to authorities, or can over polenate a harvest and make it a real pain in the butt to enjoy...Few seeds are great, but to many is a nightmare. Keep what you need only.

Once females have started too sex like 20’Thai you give them a new home like a gallon the most or 4liters. Plants will literaly take off before your eyes, till they slow down agian and start to concentrate more on thier flowering. Here is the tricky part as a Sativa will grow while it flowers, it will go into oposite phylo, leafs will revert back from 11 to 9 7 and 5 then 3 to fianly single blades....but you wait for her to flower more ! Here would also be your last selection to use for mother plants.

Ok, now i've got my females chosen I take cuts, as many as I can al the same sizes if posible, these I clone and set under 12/12 but seen this time clones are faster then parents and shouldn't branch much if you keep them near one on other and litteraly make a sea of green. As they mature you rotate them down the line till you pull them out, replace'n each time with cuts you had taken from them mid way down the process to permite better air circulation under the canopy. The idea is to truely get them in all as close as posible to each other under the lights at the same size, small plants on blocks, mid plants on something, and tall plants on the floor for example....You fill this area up in time and it’s like a machine. Bad thing is its slower, with pure sats as it is with Hybirds but works great. Keep'n your clones short by the time they finish they can grow 3-5x the starting size by finish.

In the mean time you let the original mothers and others finish off peacefully as follows, or kill them…

The more of a bud cluster you see the better, watch for bananas as stress can provoc more hermies. Kill these please, unless you got some breeding ideas later in flower and no males...but even then its not the best idea.

Well once you got a good flower cluster going you can almost think the growth has stoped, jeje well this is where we have to have an eye for this...only doing it you will learn. If you transplant to your last home before you needed too the plant will burst agian, but if you timed it right they will fatten up just right. Trail and error my friends.

I add that I only water them when abosulty necessary, if you water too often they grow faster as you provide each time more oxygen to roots and make nutrient intake and storage a lot more easy for micofilaments on roots but unless spaced out plants and provided with a lot of wind like you would out doors they would be lanky to be honest due to competition for light they will streach, but with poor root space and little food the plant could yellow out and loose some leaves too. Its important you keep the lights over them as close as you can, the further away the more the plants streach also as they feel it stronger they grow toward it. This way they stay a little shorter and are stronger I feel when done right.

Just another idea,
Chaman

Im sorry I didn't say that I would flower under MH and HPS lights combined. I used the floros while young and for clones to save cost, and for a more natural spring feeling to them as I could put up plastic to trap humity and keep soil more humid for new roots not to have such a hard time.

[Elephunt man]

Chaman:

Another way you can keep a Sativa down is by Scrog, A Single plant could spread out across about 1mtx1mt 1"x1" screen prety easy just a few cm away from the plant. Once a plant gets about 10cm tall or about 3rd true node you cut the main tip. As the new branches grow you weave them through the screen (up and over under and over) in different directions, and at about 30+ cm cna cut those main tips. Then wait for branches to grow and weave these through the screen also, and repeat all process. Remember, in scrog its going to be almost imposible to trasplant, so its best to start the plant in the place it will finish. I'd recomend a 5gall or 20liter contianer at the least. (one month of soil per month of plant life...or one gal od soil per ever foot tall of plant)

You want to cut any branches not getting good light underneath, this will give better air exchange and concentrate energy on plant surface that is exposed to the light. Its not a bad idea to clone these and set aside if the mother plant looks nice and promissing, to replace her when finished.

This while the plant is under 12/12 the whole time....id still not veg her. Also very important to keep the light over the cannopy nice and close, and to restrict water some too. This is a great method for greenhouses too.

These are all methods for mostly low land pure tropical Sativas that will grow while in flower....none of these methods would be necesary with a high land Sativa that mimics many triats of an Indica.

High land Sativas will have shorter nodes, grow mostly a main cola with little branch'n near the bottom. These plants are down in half the time as a low land, and will not streach as much as a low land ither. These are great indoor strians when able to get your hands on them.

Blessings,
Chaman
In places with humity, I recomend you space the branches some on the screen, for better air circulation and light penetration.

OH AND IMPORTANT, the very first cut you make (to cut the main tip) I'd clone this in a small cup to force flower faster then the rest of the plant, so to not wast time on a male or hermie. It would be sad to wiat about 2 months doing all this to kill a plant and start over !

[Sticky_Budz]

:greatjob: on the info bro lots of reading but god info thanks SB:pass::420:2thumbs

[Elephunt man]

Highland Thai - pure landrace from nr. Burma in the Shan Hills of Northern Thailand by ngakpa

[Elephunt man]

Columbian by Chaman

[Elephunt man]

Highland Lao - Hmong strain - very potent classy Indochinese ganja sativa, but without the paranoid edge - sandlewood aroma on curing with pleasant golden colouration to cured buds (by ngakpa)

[Elephunt man]

In honor of brother 'La Mano Negra', one of my favorite pics.

Black Congolese

http://www.homegrownbud.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=17888&stc=1&d=1222482528